Revelation fulfilled?

[Shirley]

We have three or four threads saying the same thing over and over. How about one more? Just kidding.
What I would like to know is this:
What part(s) of Revelation do y'all believe are fulfilled and what are left to be fulfilled (if any).
If its all fulfilled, where are we now? I mean, in relation to the end of days, the new heaven and new earth, and the millenium kingdom. There are so many confusing statements being made, I can't really figure out where y'all (preterist/historist) stand. Please, simple answers. I think I am not the only one becoming more confused daily.
God Bless,
Shirley

[Jan]

Revelation Chapters 1-3.

Four on, still future <><

[xcstud05]

Jan said:

Revelation Chapters 1-3.

Four on, still future <><

What is in those chapters? I don't have a Bible with me.

[parousia70]

Jan said:

Revelation Chapters 1-3.

Four on, still future <><

Interesting.
In Revelation 3, Christ promised to return "as a theif" to those at the Church of Sardis,

Based on your post above, am I correct in assuming you believe He fulfilled this promise?

[Jan]

parousia70 said:

Interesting.
In Revelation 3, Christ promised to return "as a theif" to those at the Church of Sardis,

Based on your post above, am I correct in assuming you believe He fulfilled this promise?

Sardis the city was captured twice, both times due to a false security. The church at Sardis knew what it meant to "be watchful.", and to "hold fast" and to "strengthen". It could relate to the phrase, "I will come on thee as a thief." These statements would surely remind them of the two times that the city had been taken by the enemy <><

[Heart4Him]

I say Amen to that, Jan! ;D

I believe we are in the period of the church of Laodicea, the 7th church that the epistles were written to.

[Jan]

Heart4Him said:

I say Amen to that, Jan! ;D

I believe we are in the period of the church of Laodicea, the 7th church that the epistles were written to.

I believe the Philadelphia and Laodicea church are overlapping each other - more belong to the "Laodicea" church now, than the "Philadelphia" church, but there is a remnant left of "Philadelphia" <><

[SavedByGrace33]

Hey Everyone. I don't really know what I believe has come true in Revelation as of yet, but I do believe we are nearing the time when the prophecies will be fulfilled. So Jan, what's your position on the rapture? I personally am a pretribber, but I found some amazing pics that I have been dying to share with everyone. So if you want to see them check out this site.
carmenspage.homestead.com/jesuscloud.html

God bless.
YSIC...Amber

[AJoyfulHeart]

SavedByGrace33 said:

Hey Everyone. I don't really know what I believe has come true in Revelation as of yet, but I do believe we are nearing the time when the prophecies will be fulfilled. So Jan, what's your position on the rapture? I personally am a pretribber, but I found some amazing pics that I have been dying to share with everyone. So if you want to see them check out this site.
carmenspage.homestead.com/jesuscloud.html

God bless.
YSIC...Amber

Sorry sounds weird to me like "fake photos"or dellusional. Also Satan is often referred to as an angel of light. i.e. he tries to trick people into thinking he is good while getting them to do something wrong. I would just say be careful with this kind of thing. Very , Very, Careful

[parousia70]

Jan said:

Sardis the city was captured twice, both times due to a false security. The church at Sardis knew what it meant to "be watchful.", and to "hold fast" and to "strengthen". It could relate to the phrase, "I will come on thee as a thief." These statements would surely remind them of the two times that the city had been taken by the enemy <><

Your response really dosen't address my question.

Christ made a specific promise to a specific 1st century Church that he would come to them "as a theif". (Revelation 3:1-5)

We know, from comapring scripture with scripture, that there is only one coming of Christ "as a theif":

1 Thess 5:2-4
"2 For you yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so comes as a thief in the night. 3 For when they say, "Peace and safety!" then sudden destruction comes upon them, as labor pains upon a pregnant woman. And they shall not escape. 4 But you, brethren, are not in darkness, so that this Day should overtake you as a thief."

1 Peter 3:10
"But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night, in which the heavens will pkmtyolp away with a great noise, and the elements will melt with fervent heat; both the earth and the works that are in it will be burned up

Revelation 16:15
"Behold, I am coming as a thief. Blessed is he who watches, and keeps his garments, lest he walk naked and they see his shame."

The issue is whether Christ kept His promise to come as a theif to those 1st century Christians at the Church of Sardis, or failed to keep it.

And Sardis was not the only one:

--THE RELIEF PROMISED TO BE PROVIDED BY CHRIST'S PAROUSIA--

* Christ's Coming to First-Century Thessalonica
promise: 2 Thess 1:6-7

result: their persecutors would be cut off, ending their persecution

* Christ's Coming to First-Century Thyatira
promise: Rev 2:18-25

result: their false prophetess and all her followers would be killed off by Christ's coming. The Church was granted Christ's authority.

* Christ's Coming to First-Century Pergamum
promise: Rev 2:12-16

result: the heretical Nicolaitans were to be put down by Christ's coming to Pergamum. The Nicolaitans that were causing them to break the decree of the Council of Jerusalem were killed (Rev 2:14; cf. Acts 15:28-29).

* Christ's Coming to First-Century Sardis
promise: Rev 3:1-5

result: Christ promises them that his "thief-in-the-night" coming will come upon them. They had not been faithfully expecting "the thief" as explained to them in Matt 24:43/1 Thess5:2-5. However, a few in Sardis were found worthy and had not soiled their garments. At Christ's coming to them "they walked in white, for they were worthy" (Rev 3:4-5).

* Christ's Coming to First-Century Philadelphia
promise: Rev 3:7-13

result: Christ puts down the then-contemporary Jewish persecution (3:9). He preserves the Church at Philadelphia through the testing which was then about to come upon the whole empire (3:10). God makes his faithful ones "pillars" in the Temple of God.

* Christ's Coming to First-Century Laodicea
promise: Rev 3:14-21

result: Christ is shown to be knocking at their door as first promised in Matt 24:33 (cf. also James 5:9). If they didn't repent it appears they were annihilated. Repentant and obedient followers said to become partakers of Christ's heavenly authority.

In every case, the prescribed relief is said to come via the return of Christ to them to accomplish those things. We therefore have only two choices:

(1) either Christ returned and delivered on those promises to the first-century churches, or...

(2) He did not come again to them, thus failing to fulfill the promises He made to them, and thus making St. John a false prophet

Which choice do you prefer?

Before you answer, think long and hard about the implications of option No. 2. Christ made specific promises to those churches of Asia Minor, and these were given to them by an apostle under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit. IMHO, option number two spells the end of Christianity as the true, holy, and reliable revelation of God to mankind.

What say you?

[parousia70]

Heart4Him said:

I believe we are in the period of the church of Laodicea, the 7th church that the epistles were written to.

Where does the Bible teach you this?

[parousia70]

vinsight4u said:

Jesus told us to expect Him with His reward

No, Jesus did not tell us that, He told His original audience to expect Him with His reward, and to expect it before the last of them had died:

Matt 16:27-28

27 For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works. 28 Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom.

[AJoyfulHeart]

vinsight4u said:

I believe most of Revelation is still ahead of us. As to where we are now -on the third seal. When is the rapture? Answer -at the end of the tribulation. I only try to help people with the prophecies as that is what God has called me to do.

You have a lot of insight that is why I want to ask how does the post trib view (as opposed to the pre or mid trib view) account for the children in the millenium? Your view (also called pre-wrath I believe) makes sence except I would think the bowls would cause more to be saved otherwise where do the children come from?

[Heart4Him]

parousia70 said:

Your response really dosen't address my question.

Christ made a specific promise to a specific 1st century Church that he would come to them "as a theif". (Revelation 3:1-5)

Let'd look at the letter:
Rev 3:1 "To the angel of the church in Sardis write: He who has the seven Spirits of God and the seven stars, says this: 'I know your deeds, that you have a name that you are alive, but you are dead.
Rev 3:2 'Wake up, and strengthen the things that remain, which were about to die; for I have not found your deeds completed in the sight of My God.
Rev 3:3 'So remember what you have received and heard; and keep {it,} and repent. Therefore if you do not wake up, I will come like a thief, and you will not know at what hour I will come to you.
Rev 3:4 'But you have a few people in Sardis who have not soiled their garments; and they will walk with Me in white, for they are worthy.
Rev 3:5 'He who overcomes will thus be clothed in white garments; and I will not erase his name from the book of life, and I will confess his name before My Father and before His angels.
Rev 3:6 'He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.'


They are dead, their deeds are not complete, they need to wake up, and IF they do not repent, he will come like a thief and they will not know they hour.

Several points here:
This was written in 95 A.D.
Jesus did not return yet, the Second coming is future.
IF they wake up, they will not be surprized.
And there are some who have not soiled their garments.
Salvation is received as an individual, not as a church.

These are a few of the reasons I see this letter and the others as a type of church that has existed since the beginning of Christianity, of a type of Christian that has existed since the beginning, and of a church that dominated a period in the church history. I associate the church at Sardis with the churches of the Reformation (Lutheran, Presbyterian, Methodist, etc.), and with those individiuals who have a religion, but lack fire.

What you seem to believe is that since the church existed in the 1st century, Jesus must have come back then...but too much has to be ignored, spiritualized, and revised for that.

[AJoyfulHeart]

vinsight4u said:

After this time Jesus will come as a thief -but this time people must keep their garments as in don't die -as new clothes will be given-the church already received her new clothes as the 7th trumpet at the resurrection of the just/rapture. No new get eternal life clothes will ever be given out to dead people -so here is warning that this battle is coming-but like a thief Jesus will come and you better still be alive if you have any chance of one day gaining eternal life with Him.

so then let me see if I understand? believers who are alive at the second coming of Christ get to live in the millenium but die when they are one hundred? Or do they get eternal life clothes when they are one hundred ? And any child born to these believers lives to be one hundred and if they are a believer at that point they recieve eternal life clothes and if they are not they die? but believers who die in the wrath are dead and there is no hope for them?