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Post by donkeydude on Feb 18, 2005 15:00:09 GMT -5
Gosh, DD, you sound like you have a bit of a chip on your shoulder.... Anyway, the question was: What do YOU think? Care to answer? Blessings, LJ No, I do not believe it is murder. I have never and will never support giving legal recognition to a fetus. It is a foot in the door for the right's quest to over turn Roe v. Wade. Abortion should be safe, rare, and legal.
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Post by stevec on Feb 18, 2005 16:18:33 GMT -5
No, I do not believe it is murder. I have never and will never support giving legal recognition to a fetus. It is a foot in the door for the right's quest to over turn Roe v. Wade. Abortion should be safe, rare, and legal. So your stance is that a fetus is not a human being and therefore should not be afforded the most basic human right--the right to live. Is that correct?
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Post by Jan on Feb 19, 2005 2:03:29 GMT -5
So, uhmm, if a fetus is not human, what is it, a vegetable, sponge a monkey...what is it?
Scripture is clear that everything God created reproduces after its own kind (Gen 1:21, 24). This means that at the moment of conception, what is in the womb is truly human!
Certainly Scripture portrays the baby in the womb as a human being (see Ps 139:13-15; Jer 1:5, Ex 31:22-24).
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Post by donkeydude on Feb 19, 2005 19:14:17 GMT -5
So your stance is that a fetus is not a human being and therefore should not be afforded the most basic human right--the right to live. Is that correct? I do not believe the fetus is human being until it can sustain life on it's own. Futhermore, abortion is a personal moral decsion where I do not believe I have the right to force my religous views on another.
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Post by kingsdaughter on Feb 19, 2005 22:15:59 GMT -5
I do not believe the fetus is human being until it can sustain life on it's own. Futhermore, abortion is a personal moral decsion where I do not believe I have the right to force my religous views on another
So you believe the innocent should be destroyed for the convience of the adult? so tell me where do you stand on capitol punishment? Also do you have children? Pam
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Post by LauraJean on Feb 19, 2005 23:17:23 GMT -5
Hang on, DD. First you say: No, I do not believe it is murder. I have never and will never support giving legal recognition to a fetus. And then you say: I do not believe I have the right to force my religous views on another. So which is it? Do your religious views tell you the unborn baby is an entity or not? Blessings, LJ P.S., Regarding your commentary about Roe v. Wade, you do know the ruling opinion was based on a legal falacy, don't you? (I'm referring to the Constitutionally non-existant "right to privacy.")
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Post by LauraJean on Feb 19, 2005 23:23:15 GMT -5
One other question... You say: I do not believe the fetus is human being until it can sustain life on it's own. But we see, quite often now, that babies born prior to their due dates survive quite nicely. So is there some sort of cut-off gestional-age date in your mind? Further, even full-term babies cannot survive after being born without outside intervention. So is a baby already born (but still unable to sustain its own life) also not considered a human being? (and therefor not worthy of legal protection?) Eagerly awaiting your reply, LJ
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Post by donkeydude on Feb 20, 2005 3:32:55 GMT -5
I do not believe the fetus is human being until it can sustain life on it's own. Futhermore, abortion is a personal moral decsion where I do not believe I have the right to force my religous views on another So you believe the innocent should be destroyed for the convience of the adult? so tell me where do you stand on capitol punishment? Also do you have children? Pam Again, I do not see the fetus, a cluster of continousl dividing cells, as human being. Considering this I see no reason ban abortions. As for capitol punishment, I too support its use.
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Post by donkeydude on Feb 20, 2005 3:36:13 GMT -5
Hang on, DD. First you say: And then you say: So which is it? Do your religious views tell you the unborn baby is an entity or not? Blessings, LJ P.S., Regarding your commentary about Roe v. Wade, you do know the ruling opinion was based on a legal falacy, don't you? (I'm referring to the Constitutionally non-existant "right to privacy.") I apologize I worded my reply incorrectly. No one personal beliefs should be forced on another concerning abortion. No, my personal beliefs do not tell me that a fetus is a life. As for Roe v. Wade what ever the reasoning for the ruling it stands and I fully support it.
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Post by donkeydude on Feb 20, 2005 3:39:28 GMT -5
Also do you have children? Pam No, I do not have children. Although, I have come dangerously close. My partner and I decided that since we were still in college that it wasn't the right time for us to have a child.
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Post by donkeydude on Feb 20, 2005 3:43:16 GMT -5
I guess considering my response to this thread that I will be looked down upon and my faith questioned by many of you. Rest assured my faith is strong and just because my beliefs on this issue differ from your own doesn't mean that I am any less devoted.
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Post by k8reader on Feb 20, 2005 7:27:40 GMT -5
Futhermore, abortion is a personal moral decsion where I do not believe I have the right to force my religous views on another. No one personal beliefs should be forced on another concerning abortion. Hi donkeydude! I wanted to comment because I think your position is held by many, but the logic of it is flawed. You say that you don't think religious/moral or personal beliefs should be forced on another, yet that is what our laws do every single day. Don't they? How about rape? Would you stand around and say that you can't force your own moral beliefs on that rapist? What about stealing? Assault? Incest? These are religious, moral, personal decisions made by individuals. Let me ask you a question, why is the life in a woman's body considered a baby at conception when it is planned and wanted, but is called a fetus or cell cluster, or something different when it isn't? I know that your intention is to look out for the woman who doesn't want to be pregnant, and allow her to do what she wants with "her body", yet you must admit that an abortion destroys what was once alive (Biology 101, even a paramecium is alive). What would be your reaction to a woman who decided that she just didn't want to go on having fingers on her hand? Would you stop her if she started chopping them off? Wouldn't you then be forcing your personal views on her? Just some things to consider. Oh donkeydude - you are (pre) judging others, are you not? As you know, it is the enemy who accuses, who whispers in your ear that you will be looked down on. As a fellow Christian, I recognize that I am a sinner, hopelessly in need of God's mercy and grace - why would I think you aren't a sinner too? I disagree with you about abortion. I think you are wrong 100% BUT, your salvation is between you and Jesus - period. But, remember the Holy Spirit also will let you know what is really right and wrong, not people, culture, or our emotions. The Holy Spirit convicts us in our heart, even when it is not what we want to accept.
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Post by PhilipDC78 on Feb 21, 2005 14:49:45 GMT -5
I do not believe the fetus is human being until it can sustain life on it's own. Futhermore, abortion is a personal moral decsion where I do not believe I have the right to force my religous views on another. How about a person who is on a respirator, or with some other medical device that keeps them alive when they would otherwise not be able to sustain their own lives? How about the comatose patients who cannot sustain their own lives? What about the premature babies who can be saved through modern medicine, but could be aborted if they stayed in the womb?
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Post by donkeydude on Feb 21, 2005 16:51:30 GMT -5
One other question... You say: So is there some sort of cut-off gestional-age date in your mind? Yes, most make the decsion to terminate within 3-4 months.
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Post by donkeydude on Feb 21, 2005 16:55:26 GMT -5
Let me ask you a question, why is the life in a woman's body considered a baby at conception when it is planned and wanted, but is called a fetus or cell cluster, or something different when it isn't? I would never personally make such a distinction. That is why I constantly oppose any legal recognition of a fetus.
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