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Post by Nicodemus on Apr 3, 2004 11:35:19 GMT -5
Good point, Nic! Not only that, but there is absolutely no way the AC will be able to pull off his plans of global deception with The Church still here. Right now, there are just too many Christians in key positions, and with large and loud voices, for him to be able to deceive the world. Now, with The Church taken out of the world, that's a different story. It is just that while there are so many good people trying to discredit the premillennial view by seeking holes in our Scriptural position - they are totally forgetting that there is adequate "circumstantial" evidence that indicates the church will NOT be here during the time that God has reserved for His people and His holy city. The Lord, through the Apostle Paul, told us that we need to "rightly divide the word of truth," and it is impossible to do this without a Dispensationally-sound interpretation of the Bible. By the way, I'd like to encourage you to help get the Bible Studies board on this site active. As Jan says, it should have more posts than any other board on this site.
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Post by HomeAtLast on Apr 3, 2004 11:56:10 GMT -5
It is just that while there are so many good people trying to discredit the premillennial view by seeking holes in our Scriptural position - they are totally forgetting that there is adequate "circumstantial" evidence that indicates the church will NOT be here during the time that God has reserved for His people and His holy city. The Lord, through the Apostle Paul, told us that we need to "rightly divide the word of truth," and it is impossible to do this without a Dispensationally-sound interpretation of the Bible. By the way, I'd like to encourage you to help get the Bible Studies board on this site active. As Jan says, it should have more posts than any other board on this site. What I am trying to get at is exactly as SW answered my questions. I am posing a hypothetical to hope that all will search their hearts and answer the question as to how they would feel if the rapture did not occur. Thanx and Blessings, ann
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Post by Nicodemus on Apr 3, 2004 12:11:28 GMT -5
What I am trying to get at is exactly as SW answered my questions. I am posing a hypothetical to hope that all will search their hearts and answer the question as to how they would feel if the rapture did not occur. Thanx and Blessings, ann I should have been more specific, Ann. I was not referring to you at all. I apologize for making you feel that I was directing that to you.
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Post by Nicodemus on Apr 3, 2004 12:13:47 GMT -5
But I must say, the reason that I did not answer in the sense that SonWorshipper did, is because I don't get along to well with "what if" questions that are already clearly answered in Scripture. Why seek a contigency where none exist?
But I do try my best to give a reason why it is a settled fact.
We need not fear, Ann, when we are covered with the righteousness of Jesus Christ - that He freely gives to whosoever will!
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Post by HomeAtLast on Apr 3, 2004 14:15:01 GMT -5
But I must say, the reason that I did not answer in the sense that SonWorshipper did, is because I don't get along to well with "what if" questions that are already clearly answered in Scripture. Why seek a contigency where none exist? But I do try my best to give a reason why it is a settled fact. We need not fear, Ann, when we are covered with the righteousness of Jesus Christ - that He freely gives to whosoever will! Nic, I understand....was just asking a hypothetical that I guess I do not see as being so clear if there are no many differing interpretations of the same pkmtyolpages, including, pretrib, mid trib, posttrib or no rapture theories. The question was not so much asking what you believed but how you would feel if your theory did not pan out. No offense was taken, Nic. Blessings, Ann
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Post by genesda on Apr 5, 2004 4:18:50 GMT -5
It is just that while there are so many good people trying to discredit the premillennial view by seeking holes in our Scriptural position - they are totally forgetting that there is adequate "circumstantial" evidence that indicates the church will NOT be here during the time that God has reserved for His people and His holy city. The Lord, through the Apostle Paul, told us that we need to "rightly divide the word of truth," and it is impossible to do this without a Dispensationally-sound interpretation of the Bible. By the way, I'd like to encourage you to help get the Bible Studies board on this site active. As Jan says, it should have more posts than any other board on this site. There will be no pre-trib rapture. The bible never speaks of anything except the return of Jesus for His church at the end of time here, then comes the 1000 years when the Earth will be inhabited by no one except Satan and his angels. Paul tells us that when Jesus returns, the wicked will be destroyed by the brightness of His coming. There is no clean teaching for any other events concerning Jesus' return. There will be no "secret rapture" as many teach. This is both unbiblical and untrue. [/color]
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Post by Nicodemus on Apr 5, 2004 7:56:44 GMT -5
Well of course you do not believe in the premillennial position - you believe that taking the mark of the beast is worshipping the Lord on Sunday!
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Post by genesda on Apr 5, 2004 9:56:26 GMT -5
Well of course you do not believe in the premillennial position - you believe that taking the mark of the beast is worshipping the Lord on Sunday! Where did you ever get the idea that worshipping God on a Sunday is the mark of the beast? I know it wasn't from me. Christians should worship God every day as Jesus gave us the example.
The mark of the beast is when one considers the Sunday as a holy day. This is where the difference is. God only made ONE day HIS holy sabbath and that's the 7th day of the week as He said on the very first 7th day of the very first week of time here on Earth and that's the same day Jesus kept holy and never changed. The other 6 are common work days as God also designated them. No where does the scriptures say "pick a day". The apostles kept the same day and we know that day is the same today as when Jesus walked this Earth.
By the way, no one has the mark yet. The mark won't be had until the Sunday is enforced as a holy day by national decree. Then those who accept the false holy day in opposition to God's command will have accepted the mark.
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Post by Nicodemus on Apr 5, 2004 10:22:56 GMT -5
Well of course you do not believe in the premillennial position - you believe that taking the mark of the beast is worshipping the Lord on Sunday! Where did you ever get the idea that worshipping God on a Sunday is the mark of the beast? I know it wasn't from me. Christians should worship God every day as Jesus gave us the example.
The mark of the beast is when one considers the Sunday as a holy day. This is where the difference is. God only made ONE day HIS holy sabbath and that's the 7th day of the week as He said on the very first 7th day of the very first week of time here on Earth and that's the same day Jesus kept holy and never changed. The other 6 are common work days as God also designated them. No where does the scriptures say "pick a day". The apostles kept the same day and we know that day is the same today as when Jesus walked this Earth.
By the way, no one has the mark yet. The mark won't be had until the Sunday is enforced as a holy day by national decree. Then those who accept the false holy day in opposition to God's command will have accepted the mark.
[/color][/quote] "Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days" (Col. 2:16) Since Paul told me not to let anyone jusge me for worshipping on Sunday - I'm not going to let you judge me either. Don't be silly, Gene, there will be no national decree enforcing Sunday church attendance. You know this is a present-day condemnation upon us by the prophetess.
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Post by genesda on Apr 6, 2004 6:19:59 GMT -5
If they are "brothers and sisters in Christ" this would be a non-issue - for all that are sealed of the Holy Spirit will be taken up at the rapture - it doesn't depend on our obedience or lack of it, only our "position" in Christ. So, you don't believe obedience to God determines "our position in Christ"? How does one get a "position in Christ"? [/color]
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Post by genesda on Apr 6, 2004 6:27:41 GMT -5
"Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days" (Col. 2:16) Since Paul told me not to let anyone jusge me for worshipping on Sunday - I'm not going to let you judge me either. If you understood the verses you quoted, you would know that Col.2 isn't talking about chiesling one commandment off of the tablets. You see the word "sabbath" and you "assume" that it is the commandment that is spoken of. There were other sabbath days beside the commandment sabbath and there is no Earthly reason to assume that Paul was talking about erasing one of the commandments God wrote in stone with His own finger. [/color] Don't be silly, Gene, there will be no national decree enforcing Sunday church attendance. You know this is a present-day condemnation upon us by the prophetess. This is easy to see when one doesn't use the Jesuit lies about prophetic interpretation. By the way, I admit that I didn't see this at first, but when I was shown how to understand the prophecies, I nopw can see it for myself from the scriptures only. I never was asked to accept what someone else said the scriptures say. What I believe can be seen by anyone who wishes to look, unlike those who hold to a "gap theory" in the 70 weks prophecy that really can't be found in the bible.
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Post by genesda on Apr 6, 2004 6:39:59 GMT -5
I asked this question on another thread and received no replies to it, yet. I am very curious how my brothers and sisters in Christ who believe in "the rapture" would feel if the tribulation started tomorrow and you had not been raptured up? for example: would you feel that you had misplaced you love and devotion to Jesus? Would you think that the rapture had occurred and you were not included? I am very curious about this and certainly do not want to argue with anyone or convince anyone of anything. Blessings to all, Ann Ann, are you aware that the last surviving member of the vision of Fatima said Mary told her that JP2 would be the second to last pope?
We SDA's believe that when Satan impersonates Christ, he will appear and the pope at that time will step down and give him the "chair" at the Vatican. We also believe that's why he is impersonating Mary. He is preparing the way for his acceptance as Christ when he will repudiate things Christ taught when He was here claiming changes are alright. Those changes will be opposed to what man has accepted as truth for centuries and will spell doom for those who believe his lies. Belief in Mary's appearances here is the opening of the door for spiritualism to be accepted as a truth, when it is all lies by Satan. The bible says Jesus will appear in the clouds and His people will RISE to meet Him. It doesn't say Jesus will set foot here at His second coming. The bible is clear that the wicked will be destroyed by the brightness of Christ's return. This doesn't leave any room for His walking around and ruling from Rome.
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Post by HomeAtLast on Apr 6, 2004 11:44:27 GMT -5
I asked this question on another thread and received no replies to it, yet. I am very curious how my brothers and sisters in Christ who believe in "the rapture" would feel if the tribulation started tomorrow and you had not been raptured up? for example: would you feel that you had misplaced you love and devotion to Jesus? Would you think that the rapture had occurred and you were not included? I am very curious about this and certainly do not want to argue with anyone or convince anyone of anything. Blessings to all, Ann Ann, are you aware that the last surviving member of the vision of Fatima said Mary told her that JP2 would be the second to last pope?
We SDA's believe that when Satan impersonates Christ, he will appear and the pope at that time will step down and give him the "chair" at the Vatican. We also believe that's why he is impersonating Mary. He is preparing the way for his acceptance as Christ when he will repudiate things Christ taught when He was here claiming changes are alright. Those changes will be opposed to what man has accepted as truth for centuries and will spell doom for those who believe his lies. Belief in Mary's appearances here is the opening of the door for spiritualism to be accepted as a truth, when it is all lies by Satan. The bible says Jesus will appear in the clouds and His people will RISE to meet Him. It doesn't say Jesus will set foot here at His second coming. The bible is clear that the wicked will be destroyed by the brightness of Christ's return. This doesn't leave any room for His walking around and ruling from Rome.
[/color][/quote] gene, I am aware of that fact....in fact see the St Malachy Prophecys thread that I started in Current Events or in Prophecy Guild and you will see that St. Malachy also said this, which I found quite ominous. Sr. Lucia also said in the third secret that the last Pope would be killed by many soldiers as he climbed a hill stepping over many bodies which is also what St. Malachy said. The problem that I have with your theory that Satan is impersonating Mary is that if that is true, Satan sure is converting alot of people to Jesus. I do not think that he would do that. Blessings, Ann
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Post by genesda on Apr 7, 2004 5:23:03 GMT -5
gene, I am aware of that fact....in fact see the St Malachy Prophecys thread that I started in Current Events or in Prophecy Guild and you will see that St. Malachy also said this, which I found quite ominous. Sr. Lucia also said in the third secret that the last Pope would be killed by many soldiers as he climbed a hill stepping over many bodies which is also what St. Malachy said. The problem that I have with your theory that Satan is impersonating Mary is that if that is true, Satan sure is converting alot of people to Jesus. I do not think that he would do that. Blessings, Ann Satan/Mary isn't bring anyone to Jesus. He is bring people to a false relifgion. This is what you will not accept. The Roman church is not a Christian church according to scriptural teachings. It calls itself Christian because a scripture is quoted and then a whole story is built around one or two verses which is contrary to what the bible actually teaches on the same subject.
Ann, do you actually believe I sit here and just think up ways to be critical of the Roman church? I assure you that is not the case. For the, I don't know how many times, what Christian church would attempt to change any of God's commandments such as the Rcc has done?? Mary is dead. We know that Satan can impersonate. read "Mary's" daily messages and see who the focus is on. It isn't Jesus. Here are a few:[/color] June 14, 1980: "I am the Woman clothed in the sun, I am in the heart of the Most Holy Trinity." Live in joy and confidence, because you have been marked with a seal by me and have come to form part of my property. Today I gather your little hearts into the immense, Immaculate and Sorrowful Heart of your heavenly Mother who watches over you with delight..." June 19, 1993: "...I have personally intervened, in an extraordinary way...because I am jealous of this Work of mine with the very jealousy of God. For it is through it that I will bring about the triumph of my Immaculate Heart in the world..so now...my Work must shine forth with a light that becomes stronger and stronger, because the times have arrived when my Immaculate Heart must be exalted by all the Church and all humanity." July 1, 1993: "Your heavenly Mother is glorified in you. Through you the triumph of my Immaculate heart is accomplished...I have exercised my motherly action in a powerful way in your hearts and your souls, because you must now be ready for the mission which I am entrusting to you." Jan 1, 1987: "I am the Rising Dawn...the Mother of all humanity.. I want to cover the whole world with the immaculate mantle of my virginal motherhood..you are beginning an extraordinary jubilee in honor of your heavenly Mother. I am the heavenly Mother who is leading you..and bringing you to peace. I am the Queen of Peace and the rainbow of the new alliance...I am the dawn which is arising..During these years, the Church and all of humanity will be left stupefied before the great events..which the Immaculate Heart of your heavenly Mother will bring to you. " Notice who the focus is on in these messages. It's on "Mary", not God and His saving power at all. These apparitions are obviously Satanic impersonations. [/color]
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Post by genesda on Apr 7, 2004 5:30:49 GMT -5
It is just that while there are so many good people trying to discredit the premillennial view by seeking holes in our Scriptural position - they are totally forgetting that there is adequate "circumstantial" evidence that indicates the church will NOT be here during the time that God has reserved for His people and His holy city. That's because it is full of holes and the conclusion isn't biblical. In order to believe what you do, you must first insert a gap into the 70 weeks prophecy separating the 70 week from the rest of the 69 weeks. The problem with this is any additional time that is inserted, makes it longer than 70 weeks, so now you must also stop prophetic time, which is absolutely unbiblical. God said "70 weeks", not 69 weeks plus some time that is yet undeterminable and then 1 week.
70 weeks is just what God declared, 70 weeks and no more. The 70 weeks including the 70th week, ended in 34 a.d. right on time according to God's word.
You are misreading Daniel 9 and coming to a wrong conclusion.
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