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Post by HomeAtLast on Apr 3, 2004 0:16:37 GMT -5
"But when Peter was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed" (Gal. 2:11) Peter was rebuked by Paul for false teaching and leading brethren into error. Did Peter hold a grudge against his brother for telling him the truth? "And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you; As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction" (II Pet. 3:15-16) Nowhere does the Lord tell us to "love" error. But if a person obviously loves his error, we that are the servants of the Lord are told not to strive - but to let them go on to their own destruction. I don't plan to stir up your little Catholic nest any longer. Nic, Perhaps some insight into what I was affronted by as soon as some people found out that I was RCC would help. I has basically told that RCC was not Christian. In 46 years of life as a Catholic I never ran across that until the Left Behind boards and subsequently this one. Keeping that in mind consider the number of "Catholic bashing" threads on the boards. I feel that it is my duty as an RC to defend my faith in Jesus as well as those of all of my brothers and sisters in Christ. Every word, every ideology, every statement is analyzed by nonRC people as suspect just because we are RC. Is that fair? Is that what Jesus teaches? I have not seen RC people try to question any other's beliefs. We are so busy defending ourselves that even if I for one wanted to question any one else's beliefs...when would I find the time? As has been said on this thread earlier, why is it ok to single RC people out to questions and in some cases condemn our beliefs, yet not ok to uplift fellow RC people in theie attempts? Seems a tad bit one-sided to me. Blessings, Ann
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Post by Jan on Apr 3, 2004 0:39:10 GMT -5
As I understand from what Nic has said, he was once RCC -am I wrong, Nic? Again, Ann, anyone who believes the Gospel, which is "the power of God unto salvation to everyone that believeth" (Rom 1:26), is saved, whether he be called Catholic, Baptist, or whatever. Yes, there are certainly wonderful born again Catholic brothers and sisters in Christ, and I praise God for them. May their numbers increase by millions more! But no one, no one, should be putting their faith in Mary, communion, baptism, and a number of other sacraments and works, and according to Galatians, would be fallen from grace and alienated from Christ (Galatians 5:4). <><
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Post by HomeAtLast on Apr 3, 2004 0:43:57 GMT -5
As I understand from what Nic has said, he was once RCC -am I wrong, Nic? Again, Ann, anyone who believes the Gospel, which is "the power of God unto salvation to everyone that believeth" (Rom 1:26), is saved, whether he be called Catholic, Baptist, or whatever. Yes, there are certainly wonderful born again Catholic brothers and sisters in Christ, and I praise God for them. May their numbers increase by millions more! But no one, no one, should be putting their faith in Mary, communion, baptism, and a number of other sacraments and works, and according to Galatians, would be fallen from grace and alienated from Christ (Galatians 5:4). <>< Jan, No offence intended, but there are many other threads that address those issues. Let's not make this one like all of those others. Blessings, Ann
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Post by Jan on Apr 3, 2004 1:15:50 GMT -5
Jan, No offence intended, but there are many other threads that address those issues. Let's not make this one like all of those others. Blessings, Ann You're the one that brought Nic up, not me.....I am addressing that their are Brothers and Sisters in many demoninations, etc, and you get on me for this? Ouch! And my last paragraph of my last post is true! Sorry you don't maybe agree? What I said doesn't only apply to RCC or Baptist or Methodist, etc ... but to many who believe such nonsense <><
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Post by Nicodemus on Apr 3, 2004 1:20:03 GMT -5
Jan, No offence intended, but there are many other threads that address those issues. Let's not make this one like all of those others. Blessings, Ann As long as you and other RCC's insist on placing the pronouncements of a sinful man above the perfect and complete Scriptures - and insist upon such things that are contrary to the Bible by supporting your beliefs through disjointed and out-of-context verses - you all will be deemed unbelievers by those of us that know the Word of God. But, as you say, that's just our opinion and don't bother us with the details. Ok, we won't
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Post by RealistState on Apr 3, 2004 7:03:41 GMT -5
In the four years I've been on the messageboards, I've watched some of my Catholic brothers & sisters patiently answer the same questions, distortions, and outright lies over and over and over again. It's amazing to me, sometimes. More often than not, the people asking the questions have no real interest in the answers. The way satan uses them has taken a huge toll on me ... that's a big reason why I don't post here much any more. I am SO PROUD of the patience and consistent kindess you continue to display. It makes me think of how you LIVE these verses -- they aren't just words, they are the way you ARE ... and that's TRULY what "believing the Bible" is all about. 1 Peter 3
8 Finally, all of you, live in harmony with one another; be sympathetic, love as brothers, be compkmtyolpionate and humble. 9 Do not repay evil with evil or insult with insult, but with blessing, because to this you were called so that you may inherit a blessing. 10 For, "Whoever would love life and see good days must keep his tongue from evil and his lips from deceitful speech. 11 He must turn from evil and do good; he must seek peace and pursue it. 12 For the eyes of the Lord are on the righteous and his ears are attentive to their prayer, but the face of the Lord is against those who do evil." 13 Who is going to harm you if you are eager to do good? 14 But even if you should suffer for what is right, you are blessed. "Do not fear what they fear; do not be frightened." 15 But in your hearts set apart Christ as Lord. Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect, 16 keeping a clear conscience, so that those who speak maliciously against your good behavior in Christ may be ashamed of their slander. 17 It is better, if it is God's will, to suffer for doing good than for doing evil. RealistState, Marysia, HomeAtLast ... thank you for the beautiful witness you bear to Christ our King. You are excellent representatives of ALL Christians -- not just Catholics. **edited by Citizen to amend the title. I love ALL of my Christian brothers and sisters! ** Thank you Citzen for including me. I'll readily admit that sometime my patience wears thin. But I keep praying.
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Post by Citizen on Apr 3, 2004 8:17:36 GMT -5
Thank you Citzen for including me. I'll readily admit that sometime my patience wears thin. But I keep praying. Me, too. God bless you, RealistState.
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Post by marysia on Apr 3, 2004 8:31:08 GMT -5
citizen - thank you for the time you took to post such encouragement. however, as you can see yourself - it's already turned into a shoving contest. i enjoy when people question the Rcc with sincerity, but not with contempt. it makes me find out answers i may have only taken on someone elses word. however, when replies are made and aswers are given - it's nothing less than spitting in someone's face when you're told - no your interprutation is wrong. by who's standards are we to be judged -- no one's judging is God's job and none of us meets His standards. Thank you again for your continued kindness. as long as the mod's keep the modify button available -- (i'd be lost without it ) i think we'll all be okay!
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Post by HomeAtLast on Apr 3, 2004 23:14:35 GMT -5
As long as you and other RCC's insist on placing the pronouncements of a sinful man above the perfect and complete Scriptures - and insist upon such things that are contrary to the Bible by supporting your beliefs through disjointed and out-of-context verses - you all will be deemed unbelievers by those of us that know the Word of God. But, as you say, that's just our opinion and don't bother us with the details. Ok, we won't Nic, As you know as an ex-catholic only Jesus is placed above the scriptures so your comment confuses me. I have never said "that's just your opinion and don't bother us with the details" so complete confusion sets in from your post. Blessings, Ann
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Post by HomeAtLast on Apr 3, 2004 23:19:19 GMT -5
You're the one that brought Nic up, not me.....I am addressing that their are Brothers and Sisters in many demoninations, etc, and you get on me for this? Ouch! And my last paragraph of my last post is true! Sorry you don't maybe agree? What I said doesn't only apply to RCC or Baptist or Methodist, etc ... but to many who believe such nonsense <>< Jan, I was just trying to explain to Nic (as he is relatively new on the boards), why I feel as I do sometimes and the history of the threads from my point of view. I certainly did not mention your name in the post to Nic, at all. As for "getting on you", I do not see how you construed that from stating that there are other threads in existence addressing the issues you brought up. I certainly meant nothing personal or derogatory by it at all and apologize if you took it personally as a "bash" in some way. It was CERTAINLY not intended that way at all. Blessings, Ann
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Post by Metanoia on Apr 5, 2004 8:57:52 GMT -5
" Peter was rebuked by Paul for false teaching and leading brethren into error. Did Peter hold a grudge against his brother for telling him the truth? Please show me where Peter was teaching a false gospel.
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Post by Nicodemus on Apr 5, 2004 9:13:23 GMT -5
"But when Peter was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed" (Gal. 2:11) Peter was rebuked by Paul for false teaching and leading brethren into error. Did Peter hold a grudge against his brother for telling him the truth? "And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you; As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction" (II Pet. 3:15-16) Nowhere does the Lord tell us to "love" error. But if a person obviously loves his error, we that are the servants of the Lord are told not to strive - but to let them go on to their own destruction. I don't plan to stir up your little Catholic nest any longer. Metanoia, where praytell do you find me accusing the Apostle Peter of teaching a false Gospel? The Gospel has to do with "getting" saved. Peter was confusing the believers with his attempt to obey the Jewish rituals - causing some to stumble (even Barnabas).
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Post by Metanoia on Apr 5, 2004 11:44:54 GMT -5
Metanoia, where praytell do you find me accusing the Apostle Peter of teaching a false Gospel? The Gospel has to do with "getting" saved. Peter was confusing the believers with his attempt to obey the Jewish rituals - causing some to stumble (even Barnabas). Let me rephrase that, "false teaching" is what you said. Where did Peter teach falsely?
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Post by Nicodemus on Apr 5, 2004 11:56:00 GMT -5
Let me rephrase that, "false teaching" is what you said. Where did Peter teach falsely? It may be found in the book of Galatians, chapter 2, verses 11 through 17. And just for the record, Paul told Peter he was falsely teaching that the Gentiles were to obey Jewish riturals. Rituals that he himself was not willing to follow - except in the presence of other Jews. "11But when Peter was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed. 12For before that certain came from James, he did eat with the Gentiles: but when they were come, he withdrew and separated himself, fearing them which were of the circumcision. 13And the other Jews dissembled likewise with him; insomuch that Barnabas also was carried away with their dissimulation. 14But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews? 15We who are Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles, 16Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified. 17But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid!" Verse 14 is a clear as can be - "they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel" - they were teaching, observing, practicing something that was contrary to the Gospel. They were all already saved believers, but their actions were causing others to stumble and to believe that they had to mix grace with law for salvation. In verse 18, we read: "For if I build again the things which I destroyed, I make myself a transgressor." is the indictment. Peter, if through preaching grace, you have told people that the law no longer can apply and that Judaism is now superceded by Christianity - why then are you now teaching by your example and practice that people really SHOULD obey Judaism? Granted, the above statement is my understanding of the context and restatement of the event.
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Post by Jan on Apr 5, 2004 19:56:13 GMT -5
In agreement, Nic. Correct! <><
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