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Post by woodyblueeyes on Mar 4, 2005 12:18:09 GMT -5
Except in your rapture scenario, the people who are "left behind" are the unrighteous and in the Noah analogy the people who are "left behind" are the righteous.
Actually, no, that's not what I was trying to offer. IF Noah and his family had been "left behind" as you put it, then Noah and his family would have been destroyed as well. God protected Noah FROM the judgement of the flood. Just as God will protect His children from the judgement of the tribulation. How? I believe by removing them from the judgement, i.e. the rapture of the church.
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Post by woodyblueeyes on Mar 4, 2005 12:18:52 GMT -5
So the kingdom of heaven is literally a mustard seed? I'm not agreeing or disagreeing that Revelation is symbolic, but you can't just say that the whole Bible has to be 100% literal, or 100% figurative/symbolic. Yeah yeah...that seemed kind of hokey after I re-read it...probably not the best choice of words to use...hehe.
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Post by LauraJean on Mar 4, 2005 12:33:40 GMT -5
My apologies. I was offering an opinion as to an analogy that was given. I can tell from the reply that my opinion was cast aside and not even considered. I was not expecting to be attacked because of what "church" I happen to attend. If some of you are so indoctrinated that you're not willing to at least read other peoples opinions without giving them the cordiality of at least reading it without turning their opinion into ammunition, then possibly you could state that at the outset, so at least the corresponding attacks won't be a surprise. I'll continue to read along and respect others opinions as I read them, but I'm not sure that I'm up to post anything further. Sigh. I was afraid of this. My comments were not an attack, personal or otherwise. I apologize if you took them that way. I was merely using an example from your denomination to demonstrate the error in your logic; namely, that the entire Bible is either all literal or all figurative. I'm very sorry if I've scared you off the discussion. I am quite interested in other peoples' opinions, and if I see something that doesn't make sense to me, I like to explore it. It seems sensible to use examples my discussion partner (you, in this case) can relate to. If you prefer I use a different tactic in our conversation, I'm happy to do so. Back to the matter at hand; Am I correct in surmising (based on your comment to Philip) that you are backing away from your statement, "If Revelation is symbolic, then the rest of the bible must be symbolic. I don't think you can pick and choose what you wish to be symbolism and what you choose to be actual."? Blessings, LJ
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Post by LauraJean on Mar 4, 2005 12:37:48 GMT -5
Actually, no, that's not what I was trying to offer. IF Noah and his family had been "left behind" as you put it, then Noah and his family would have been destroyed as well. Can we go back to the text for a second? MT 24:37 As it was in the days of Noah, so it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 38 For in the days before the flood, people were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, up to the day Noah entered the ark; 39 and they knew nothing about what would happen until the flood came and took them all away. That is how it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 40 Two men will be in the field; one will be taken and the other left. 41 Two women will be grinding with a hand mill; one will be taken and the other left.
Who, in verses 40 and 41 are left? Because it's quite clear in verse 38 that the ones left are Noah and family. I disagree. Genesis 6:6 tells us God judged mankind, Genesis 6:7 was the proclamation of God's decision based on His judgement. The flood is the result of the judgement. Noah was also judged and found righteous, as we see in Genesis 6:8. Blessings, LJ
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Post by woodyblueeyes on Mar 4, 2005 12:59:49 GMT -5
Can we go back to the text for a second? MT 24:37 As it was in the days of Noah, so it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 38 For in the days before the flood, people were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, up to the day Noah entered the ark; 39 and they knew nothing about what would happen until the flood came and took them all away. That is how it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 40 Two men will be in the field; one will be taken and the other left. 41 Two women will be grinding with a hand mill; one will be taken and the other left.
Who, in verses 40 and 41 are left? Because it's quite clear in verse 38 that the ones left are Noah and family. Ok, lets look at verses 40 and 41. The one man that is taken... WHERE is he taken to? The woman grinding that is taken... WHERE is she taken to? And WHY is the one taken and the one left? We might be talking apples and oranges. In the scripture you posted. Do you think that the ones taken are the unbelievers? And the ones left are the believers?
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Post by LauraJean on Mar 9, 2005 11:14:34 GMT -5
Ok, lets look at verses 40 and 41. The one man that is taken... WHERE is he taken to? The woman grinding that is taken... WHERE is she taken to? The answer to this is found in the analogy of Noah. When all the "dust" settled, who was left? Noah and his family. So the ones taken were the rest of the people on the Earth. They were destroyed. So in Jesus's description the ones taken are taken to Hell. Because God has adjudged one unrighteous and one righteous. Yup. That's exactly what I think, again, based on the analogy drawn to Noah. Further support for this view can be found in 1 Peter 3, where Noah is described as being saved through the water. Can I properly surmise by your question that you think the ones left are the unbelievers? Blessings, LJ
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Post by marysia on Mar 10, 2005 10:53:15 GMT -5
Good Morning LJ, have to concur with those left behind being belivers versus non. granted i'm very new to the rapture theory, only learning of in mid '99 through the series. since coming to this board (and the priors) i've heard more and more. growing up Rcc we were told of the "Three Days of Darkness". a time just before Christ' return to the earth when (basically) all hell would break loose on the earth. Those who knew and believed in Christ would put their faith fully in Him and would wait out the 3 days in deep prayer. I remember being warned by my parents that - once it began - even if they knocked on my door I was not to open for it would really be satan trying to get me to loose faith in Jesus. My mom would continue that she and my dad would be praying already and would not be outside knocking on my door.
i know it's a rather strange "story" theory or His Second Coming, however.... I've always enjoyed reading the various folklore, stories and traditions of not only the rapture,Second Coming or even just ethnic traditions -- i figure only God knows exactly what will happen and how and when so....
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Post by christian on Mar 10, 2005 13:21:39 GMT -5
I'm in agreement with Woody on this one. Noah wasn't raptured. Most believers who are around today will be raptured to meet the the Lord Jesus Christ in the heavens. Just like Enoch in the Old Testament.
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Post by christian on Mar 10, 2005 13:31:05 GMT -5
But if anyone here prefers to be left behind with the wicked and immoral people of this World, I'm sure the good Lord won't say no.......
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