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Post by SonWorshiper on Dec 17, 2003 13:03:36 GMT -5
Whatever man. While you claim it is the authors of The Bible who have let their imaginations run amuck, I believe in reality that it is you who have.
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Post by keikikoka on Dec 17, 2003 15:31:27 GMT -5
So, kkwahol, you give yourself authority based on your own experiences? This is why you post this stuff here with nothing to support anything you say?
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Post by kkawohl on Dec 17, 2003 17:34:49 GMT -5
Please peruse my book which can be accessed FREE at: www.transcendentalism.us/ (All profits from the book are donated to charities) I have posted on numerous boards. The surprising results have been that many who practice logical reasoning have suggested as an answer to religious radicals, that they read my book. Transcendentalism is a philosophy based on Immanuel Kant's statement that some notions (such as space/time, morality, and divinity} cannot be directly experienced, yet still add to empirical knowledge. These notions are transcendental in that they have a higher order of existence than what we experience directly in the physical world. Kant called these notions noumena (vs. phenomena, physical things and events.) Transcendentalism is not a religion but is the logic and rationality that can and should be applied to them. It is a conglomeration of similar, but diverse ideas about literature, religion, culture and philosophy. A system of philosophy emphasizing the intuitive and spiritual above the empirical and material. www.authorzone.com/view_authors.php?authorid=1426Transcendentalism Today, Org. with Kurt Kawohl as its founder is a member of: IONS - Institute of Noetic Sciences, World Interfaith Congress, United Communities of Spirit, Alliance for Spiritual Community, Interfaith Voices for Peace And Justice.
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Post by mook2357 on Dec 17, 2003 18:45:20 GMT -5
kkawohl, I haven't checked out your book or site yet...but I plan to! I would love to read it and see what else you have to say. Here is actually the really amazing part though. While you are absolutely correct on everything you are saying, do you also realize how TRUE the Bible ends up being, just not in the way many would like to apply it? Or the Qur'an? I find it fascinating that while many tell me that I believe contrary to the Bible, and if that means the way that they interpret it, I DO...that I myself FIND ALL THE TRUTH clearly laid out in the Bible. Jesus told us this too! After telling a parable, he says: Matthew 13:9 Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.
Matthew 13:10 And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables?
Matthew 13:11 He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.
Matthew 13:12 For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath.
Matthew 13:13 Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.
Matthew 13:14 And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Esaias, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and shall not perceive:
Matthew 13:15 For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.
Matthew 13:16 But blessed are your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear.
Matthew 13:17 For verily I say unto you, That many prophets and righteous men have desired to see those things which ye see, and have not seen them; and to hear those things which ye hear, and have not heard them. I find it amazing that it is those that are MOST ENGROSSED in the truth that fail to SEE the truth. But a prophet is a prophet for a reason, eh?
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Post by mook2357 on Dec 17, 2003 19:18:37 GMT -5
Kurt: Awesome. Hey...I have to ask...how much of this was "realization" and how much was "investigation?" I mean...you mentioned the effect 9-11 had on you...was this all sort of brought about as your vision on evolution and our history was? A sense of knowing, or a spiritual understanding? Or did you do study up on comparitive religions to see and comprehend this through study? Or a bit of both? I am curious because your experience sounds so very similar to mine. Oh, also...if you are interested in some proofreading for your book...let me know. Do you also have this in print, or do you intend to get it printed? Thanks!
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Post by kkawohl on Dec 17, 2003 19:37:07 GMT -5
kkawohl, I haven't checked out your book or site yet...but I plan to! I would love to read it and see what else you have to say. Here is actually the really amazing part though. While you are absolutely correct on everything you are saying, do you also realize how TRUE the Bible ends up being, just not in the way many would like to apply it? Or the Qur'an? I find it fascinating that while many tell me that I believe contrary to the Bible, and if that means the way that they interpret it, I DO...that I myself FIND ALL THE TRUTH clearly laid out in the Bible. I find it amazing that it is those that are MOST ENGROSSED in the truth that fail to SEE the truth. But a prophet is a prophet for a reason, eh? I Agree. These so-called Holy Books could be inspirational and could help us in our journey through life if one discounts all the references to the writers vivid imaginations of physical sightings or conversations with God, Satan, snakes, devils or angels. Condemnations of those who do not believe what is written or question these so-called Holy Books and condemnation of any kind also should be eliminated. The Torah, Bible and the Koran need to be edited and brought into the 21st century where religion is not based on slavery to God. The Ultimate Truth is indecipherable by the human mind and can only be divulged to the spirit which also often misinterprets its meaning, hence we have various religions and beliefs.
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Post by kkawohl on Dec 17, 2003 19:46:52 GMT -5
Kurt: Awesome. Hey...I have to ask...how much of this was "realization" and how much was "investigation?" I mean...you mentioned the effect 9-11 had on you...was this all sort of brought about as your vision on evolution and our history was? A sense of knowing, or a spiritual understanding? Or did you do study up on comparitive religions to see and comprehend this through study? Or a bit of both? I am curious because your experience sounds so very similar to mine. Oh, also...if you are interested in some proofreading for your book...let me know. Do you also have this in print, or do you intend to get it printed? Thanks! A bit of both, though my writing ability is wanting. Prior to my last 2 spiritual experiences after 9-11-01 I had no writing experience at all. I wrote a book which is available through Barnes&Noble and amazon but i realize that it is mediocre at best. Any help is appreciated. Thanks, Kurt Kawohl
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Post by mook2357 on Dec 17, 2003 21:02:05 GMT -5
Well if you can get me a copy in Word or a manuscript copy, I can edit it some for you. If it is in Word, I can edit it in red or something so that you see what I did. I could copy it into word and do it myself, but if you have a copy already in the program, the formats would stand and all that too. My email is mook2357@hotmail.com if you want to send a copy. It isn't written too poorly, but you made a few typos and left out a couple of words that I saw as I was first reading, so I figured maybe you could use a little help with that...another set of eyes always helps. Mentally, I plug words in all the time that aren't there when reading back something I have written...we all do to some extent and it makes it hard to proofread our own work. Just let me know!
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Post by mook2357 on Dec 17, 2003 21:04:13 GMT -5
Oh, btw, nothing needs eliminated from the texts...they just need to be understood. I would love to discuss with you particular pkmtyolpages that you feel should be removed, and maybe you can see better what I mean. I think that you NEED to see this, as you have seen a lot of it already... This thread...another thread, privately...however. Just let me know of one to a few examples that we can discuss and we will start with those.
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Post by Jan on Dec 17, 2003 21:18:46 GMT -5
"Hymns to an Unknown God," lists six ways to "feed your soul." One might suppose they would mention prayer and the reading of Scripture. But no, those archaic practices are far too mundane for these enlightened folks. Their list includes: slow down, listen to your body’s wisdom, start your day gently, follow your bliss, tell a story, and create a ritual. We seem to be showing an increasing aversion to any moral structure that dares limit us with "Thou shalt’s" and "Thou shalt not’s." The clash between those evangelical Christians who hold to the standards and values of holy Scripture, and those who have rejected the inspiration and reliability of the Bible, has always existed in some degree. As Americans move further and further from Scriptural truth, Christians can expect to be vilified and ridiculed as never before. Clashes are certain to continue in the courts and in the public forums. Those of us who love the Bible cannot expect to win every battle, and may, in fact, lose the majority of them. Our job is not so much to win as it is to proclaim God’s truth and snatch as many from the fire as will hear our message. America has turned her back on God. Our loving Heavenly Father has offered us His free gift of salvation through Jesus Christ His Son, and we have said, "Thanks, but no thanks." In our rush to grab all the gusto we can, we have missed God. There is a “New Tolerance” which is a product of modern society’s rejection of God. You see, if there is no God, then there are no objective standards. Every person’s opinion is as good and valid as any other person’s. And no one has a right to judge or condemn any one else — unless, of course, the person is exhibiting some form of intolerance! It is okay to bash Christians, but it is morally wrong to criticize homosexuals. It is okay to put a crucifix in a jar of urine and call it art, but it would be totally unacceptable to put a rainbow pin in the same jar (because it symbolizes the New Age Movement). And it is okay to boycott an American corporation that pollutes the atmosphere or exploits foreign workers, but it is totally unacceptable to boycott a corporation that promotes gross immorality. There is a growing attitude of acceptance of other religions as legitimate avenues to God and salvation. This attitude dominates both the National and World Councils of Churches. The attitude is usually expressed in the following manner: “There are many roads to God because He has revealed Himself in many different ways.” Because of this apostasy, many Christian leaders are now taking the position that it is wrong to send out missionaries because they violate the cultural sensitivities of foreign peoples and because they communicate the idea that there is something superior about the Christian message. All of which makes a liar of Jesus who said, “I am the way, the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father, but through me” (John 14:6). It also makes a liar of the Apostle Peter who proclaimed in Acts 4:12 that “there is salvation in no one else [but Jesus]; for there is no other name under heaven that has been given among men, by which we must be saved.” As we await His return, we are not to give in to the “New Tolerance.” We are to be loving, but not indifferent. We are called to be the salt and light of the world (Matthew 5:13-14). That means we are to stand up and speak out in behalf of righteousness. “Hate evil, you who love the Lord.” — Psalm 97:10 God asks: “Who will stand up for Me against evil doers? Who will take his stand for Me against those who do wickedness?” — Psalm 94:16 “Abhor evil. Cling to what is good.” — Romans 12:9 “Hate evil. Love good. And establish justice.” — Amos 5:15 As these Scriptures clearly teach, we must boldly tell the world that there is a God who hates sin and who hates it so much that He sent His only Son to die for our sins so that we might be reconciled to our Creator. <><
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Post by mook2357 on Dec 17, 2003 21:24:56 GMT -5
Jan, no offense intended in pointing this out to you... But the rainbow doesn't symbolize the New Age movement...it symbolizes gay pride... I know to some Christians that may seem interchangeable, but I assure you that when you see that rainbow...it has nothing to do with religion.
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Post by SonWorshiper on Dec 17, 2003 23:20:18 GMT -5
That was a great post, Jan! But, unfortunately, the blind seem to be perfectly content to stay that way.
God bless! ;D
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Post by heathen76 on Dec 17, 2003 23:53:58 GMT -5
That was a great post, Jan! But, unfortunately, the blind seem to be perfectly content to stay that way. God bless! ;D If you and Jan wish to walk around with all that anger, then by all means, feel free to do so. Just don't expect everyone else to follow suit.
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Post by HomeAtLast on Dec 18, 2003 0:06:37 GMT -5
If you and Jan wish to walk around with all that anger, then by all means, feel free to do so. Just don't expect everyone else to follow suit. Just need to comment, heathen, that I see no anger whatsoever in SonWorshipper or Jan's posts, just frustration for another lost soul. Blessings, Ann
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Post by Jan on Dec 18, 2003 0:45:34 GMT -5
If you and Jan wish to walk around with all that anger, then by all means, feel free to do so. Just don't expect everyone else to follow suit. I don't believe I posted in anger, heathen, only in truth - His Truth. Now you can accept His Truth or disregard it...but there will come a time when He asks you, "why did you not listen?" And what answer will you have for Him?
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